Christian Bible Study Made Simple: Two Fish Podcast
The Two Fish Podcast, hosted by Nick and Aaron, is a Christian Bible Study, with a goal to go through scripture together while keeping it simple and having practical application to our everyday lives. Our prayer is that Christ takes the Two Fish and spreads it through out the world.
Christian Bible Study Made Simple: Two Fish Podcast
Hebrews' Message to Jewish Converts
Who really wrote the Book of Hebrews, and why does it matter? In this episode, we tackle the enduring mystery of its authorship and the ongoing debate over whether Paul was behind its composition. By contrasting Hebrews with Paul's other letters, we highlight the unique stylistic differences and set the scene for understanding the complex context in which it was written. This book was aimed at Jewish converts grappling with the seismic shift from Old Testament practices to the revolutionary teachings of Jesus—a transition that was anything but smooth.
Moving on, we shine a spotlight on Jesus' divine nature and unparalleled purpose as depicted in Hebrews and the Gospel of John. You'll hear about His portrayal as the radiance of God's glory and the exact imprint of His nature, existing from the dawn of creation. This episode underscores the shift from God communicating through prophets to the direct revelation through His Son, Jesus—who purified sins and now reigns at God's right hand. We also touch on the significant roles angels played in biblical narratives, ultimately reinforcing Jesus' supreme status over all heavenly beings.
Lastly, we dissect the hierarchy and superiority of Jesus within Jewish tradition and Christian theology. Jewish culture revered angels, but Hebrews makes it clear: Jesus stands far above them. Using various scriptures, we illustrate that God never bestowed the same honor upon angels as He did upon His Son. Through these passages, we emphasize Jesus' eternal nature and supreme authority, making it clear that while angels serve as messengers, Jesus reigns as the eternal King. So, grab a friend and join us for this enriching exploration of the Book of Hebrews, and stay tuned for more thought-provoking discussions.
Welcome back to the Two Fish Podcast. My name is Nick, I'm Aaron and this week we're starting the letter of the Bible called Hebrews.
Speaker 2:Hey, that's right, two Fish community. We are back for another exciting episode and we are diving into the book of Hebrews. We're excited to have you join us. And we are diving into the book of Hebrews. We're excited to have you join us Once again. We encourage you to go out and grab a friend and sit down and do this with them as well. After you listen to the episode, go through, read it. We like to describe it as campfire discussions.
Speaker 1:So we would really encourage you to go grab a friend, have them listen the episode and then have discussion. Yeah, exactly, hebrews. Man, it's right after by lehman, which we've done. If you haven't heard that study, go back. Not that these have anything to do with each other, just kind of doing some prep work for this. Uh, hebrews, no one knows who wrote it. There's some theories.
Speaker 2:We got some good guesses and, and I think a lot of times you'll hear people say, oh, it's probably wrote by paul, right? That's one of the most more common names thrown out there, because he wrote the majority of the new new testament, right, and his name gets thrown out there a lot, um, but if you dive into it and you listen to theologians out there the people that like really dive into the roots of these things they say it's definitely not paul it could have maybe been somebody that was following paul yeah but they don't believe it was wrote by paul and I just got just of the books that we've done, that paul has done, which we've done a lot of them.
Speaker 1:I said philemon is the book right before it, verse number one paul, prisoner of christ and timothy, our brother. To philemon, almost every single one of his books, there's a specific greeting he does. He says this is who I am and this is why you can trust me.
Speaker 2:Right, and one of our last studies. Oh boy, you bring that up. I wish I would have been ready for this. He actually points to you know, this is me writing, because of the way I write my letters because, of the way I write my letter, and so you can come to Hebrews and you can conclude that it's likely not Paul, because it's not wrote like Philemon or the letter to the Corinth or any of those other letters, because it doesn't open the same and it doesn't close the same.
Speaker 1:And really it doesn't even feel the same. And we've done Philemon, we've done all the way to Revelation. We didn't do Revelation. We've done a lot of these last books. We skipped Hebrews on purpose, because it's written different. It's just a different style of writing and to me, when I read it, I'm like this is a. This is gonna be a lot harder in my mind as we go through this. And so this just forefront here this is gonna to take us longer than a normal book and I don't think that's a bad thing. It's just going to take longer and we're not going to do it straight. We'll get some other episodes in some topical stuff and we've got a couple other things planned that we've had planned in our minds for a long time and just haven't executed on it.
Speaker 2:But this is going to take a while even just this first chapter, but I guess let's just get into it. Yeah, I think where I was hoping you were going with that was a lot of paul's other letters are wrote to the gentiles and this letter was not wrote to gentiles, it was wrote to jewish. Um, what do they call them? Jewish converts? So they are. He's writing to a devout Jewish community that had split. I didn't dive into this too much, but they had split off and they were kind of their own community. But they had similar to Paul, they had the really Jewish background where the.
Speaker 2:Gentiles were not that. So this letter, impartially, is probably wrote different due to the audience that it is being wrote to.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:That does not mean that it does not apply to us today. I had the thought as we were preparing for this. Maybe it's for today's terms. The more established Christian was a thought I had, but it applies to all of us. I don't know if that's a good thought or a bad thought on how to relate to it, but I think it was definitely a Jewish community and not a Gentile community.
Speaker 1:And I think the problem and I can see myself in that situation as God spoke through prophets and then all of a sudden, he goes silent. God goes silent, doesn't talk to anyone for like 400 years I think the numbers is and then all of a sudden, jesus comes along and Jesus says hey, I'm the one you guys have been waiting on. And for 400 years, these generations of Jews have just gone along with the status quo and the culture of well, this is what the Old Testament said we need to do. And then all of a sudden, here comes someone that says now you can do it differently. I think that'd be a struggle. I would struggle with that. If it's something I knew deep down, this is the way god has asked me to do sacrificing for sins. I've learned my whole life. This is what and it's biblical.
Speaker 1:And then all of a sudden, here comes this guy named jesus saying I don't have to do that anymore and yes there's signs that point to jesus is the answer, and they should have known it, and a lot of them did know it. You know what I mean. They came to accept it. I think this is just a hard time period where jesus is saying, okay, now we're moving on to something new, we have a new covenant, and so these are the jews that are have converted, but they're probably still struggling there, so let's get right into it. Get right into it. We're six, seven minutes in um. Again. I'm reading from the esv or die version what do you have tonight? What is that?
Speaker 2:thing, the niv, every man's bible, oh nice it looks like never mind it's an old bible it looks like every man has handled. Oh my goodness, that's funny all right, here we go.
Speaker 1:Hebrews, chapter one, verse one. Long ago, at many times and in many ways, god spoke to our fathers by the prophets, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world. He is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature, and he upholds the universe by the word of his power. After making purification for sin, he sat down at the right hand of the majesty on high, having become as much superior to angels as the name he has inherited is more excellent than theirs. All right, we'll stop right there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think the the first thing I just want I want to go back to uh once again is like this clearly doesn't open like a paul's letter. Yeah right, this is this guy. Just like we often say, here comes paul with a hammer. Right, whoever wrote this, he just came with a hammer there was no warning. Yeah, like I'm gonna tell you who jesus christ is and this is your god.
Speaker 1:Yeah um, again, like I said earlier, prophets. God spoke to prophets and then jesus came and and there's so many people that want to take the bible and say, okay, it's not for today, or it's not true, or or it's not true, or or it's not true, or we can't like. He lays it down. Right here he says whom he appointed, the air of all things, through whom also he created the world. And right here he's saying he is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature. Like Jesus is God. He was there at the beginning when God formed the earth world.
Speaker 1:John one one says in the beginning was the word capital W talking about Jesus and the word was with God and the word was God. And the writer he was just doubling down on that saying he was always there. God spoke through the prophets and then he sent Jesus, his son, and now he's speaking through Jesus. And then he gives the purpose. I mean there's so much here. He gives the purpose for Jesus. He says after making purification for sins, he returned at the right hand of the majesty on high. What was the purpose of Jesus? He came to purify sins so that these Jews, who he's writing to no longer have to do sacrificial things for their sins.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Jesus was the sacrifice.
Speaker 1:Ultimate Verse 4 said Having become as much superior to angels as the name he has inherited is more excellent than those. How does your Bible read there, verse 4?
Speaker 2:I was still hung up on verse 3. All right, but like I'm just hung up, the sun radiate God's own glory.
Speaker 1:Ooh, that's a good way to say it too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's how mine reads. Yours was a little different.
Speaker 1:My verse three was he is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature.
Speaker 2:The sun radiates God's own glory and expresses the very character of God. I don't know, that's just powerful.
Speaker 1:That's a powerful way to describe something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, of god, I don't know, it's just powerful. That's a powerful way to describe something. Yeah, and like in your opening, your opening paragraph to your thesis, that you're writing to a community, and that's like I'm just gonna tell you where I'm coming from, yeah, and this is where I'm coming from and what I believe, and this is what you should believe, right? And then verse four, mine, reads this shows that the sun is far greater than the angels, just as the name of god gave him greater than their names because angels are created beings.
Speaker 1:And here he's the exact imprint impression of god. He radiates god image so clearly. He's above the writer. He was doubling down on the fact that he is above even angels, which a lot of these Jews having converted. You think about Paul. He was Saul. He did not believe in Jesus, the Jesus of the Messiah. He came after Christians. Then he was saved on the road to Damascus and then he realized, oh my gosh, okay, okay, jesus is who he says. He is Moving on verse number five. He's kind of doubling down on this fact of Jesus who they knew walked among them, maybe not these specific Jews, but he walked among the Jewish people, the apostles that were there at the time. He's doubling down on this Verse five. He says for to which of the angels did God ever say you are my son today, I have begotten you. Stopping right there. He's clearly putting Jesus above heavenly beings.
Speaker 2:He's saying God clearly, jesus above heavenly beings or angels, yeah, yeah, jesus is above, above it all. And you can go to the old testament. You're going to read about some angels, right, and like they're. Well, I mean, the whole concept of satan is he's a fallen angel, right, yeah? And this writer is just saying look at these. God said you are my son. Today I have become your father. That immediately puts him above all other things. And then he says you will sit at my right hand. You will sit the right hand, god. Nobody else there's not angels sitting there.
Speaker 2:There's not angels sitting there now.
Speaker 1:The disciples tried to argue who would get to sit to the right hand of jesus right but that's not the right hand of god, that's the right hand of jesus yeah so, god, clearly put him on the pillar, put him above everything else, yeah well, I I'm glad you brought that old testament part up, because if, when you read through the old testament which the torah Torah our first three books was their Torah all through there an angel appeared. Just think of the story of Jesus's birth. An angel appeared to Mary. An angel appeared to Sarah, her cousin and her husband. An angel appeared to Joseph.
Speaker 1:Like all through the old Testament, god appears here and there, but then angels appear also and they're messengers in the old Testament. So a one of these Jewish people that this writer's writing to like that's a part of their culture. They're angels, they're heavenly beings, and I think they have put I want to say like, kind of like catholics have put mary on a pedestal. These jewish people have grown up understanding how important to their history angels were and then, all of a sudden, this guy named jesus comes in and says hey, I'm the son of god. That just counter.
Speaker 2:It goes against what they've been taught their whole lives and what they know from their history now that's, that's really good, and so that would have been a way that people were related, god speaking to them, right, yeah, and you can go back up to verse one. Long ago, god spoke many times and in many ways, um, so he spoke to moses through burning bush. He spoke to elijah through an angel who brought him food. In the book of kings, um, he spoke through dream. So he spoke to people in lots of different ways, but a lot of them associated angels with it, because it shows up a lot and and maybe they even made some of those prophets of the old idols, right, yeah, and? And the writer is saying he's not saying jesus was an angel. He's saying jesus is far greater than the angels that you currently. I don't know if they worshiped them, but they clearly thought very highly of them.
Speaker 1:And this writer is saying no whatever you think of them you need to bring this guy up five notches above, whatever you think of them and I think the example there, verse five when did god ever say you are my son to an angel? You are my son. When jesus is baptized and christ comes out of the water by john the baptist, a dove comes down and and a voice of from heaven says this is my son, whom I love. With him, I am well pleased. The writer hebrews is saying that jesus god, has never said that about an angel or any other spiritual being, it's just. This is another level.
Speaker 1:He's just trying to hone down on the fact that there's a order to holiness and jesus is right up there at the top he is the top he is the top yes, not right up there, he's the top, verse number seven, moving on of the angels, he says he makes his angels winds and his ministers of flame and fire. But of the sun, he says your throne, oh, is forever and ever. The scepter of your righteousness is the scepter of your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness. Therefore, god, your God, has anointed you with the oil of gladness, beyond your companions. I mean again a stark difference, a stark. Of the angels, he says hey, these are the guys that are going to carry out my mission. They're doing stuff for me. Angels were created to worship. They're worshipers. But what is your? Verse seven says again, mine says he makes his angels winds and his ministers a flame of fire mine reads regarding the angels.
Speaker 2:He says he sends his angels like the winds, his servants like the flames of fire so they're there to. They're there to do things, they're there to say things, they're there to be messengers and they're plentiful, like I kind of hear that in that, like it sends them, like the winds there's, there's plenty of them, and there's only one that he has called his son just a quick um google search.
Speaker 1:The bible says myriads of myriads, or tens of thousands times tens of thousands of angels. There's legions of angels, so you're talking a hundred million, plus just those quick numbers added there, of angels and of all them Jesus is above them. That's pretty crazy.
Speaker 2:Verse 10. He also says to the son in the beginning Lord, you laid the foundation of the earth and made the heavens with your hands. They will perish, but you remain forever. They will wear out like old clothing. You will fold them up like a cloak and discard them like old clothing, but you are always the same you will live forever. God never said to any of the angels sit in the place of.
Speaker 1:That's so good. I referenced John, the gospel of John I'm going to. I turned there here John 1, 1. In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God.
Speaker 1:He was in the beginning, with God. All things were made through him, and without him, him, nothing was made. That has been made In him was life, and the life was the light of the man. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. I really think that's pointing to what he's saying right there. Your Lord laid the foundation of the earth in the beginning. There will perish, but you will remain. Your years have no end.
Speaker 2:You will remain forever.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:They will wear out like old clothing talking about the heavens and the earth.
Speaker 1:Like it's. It's all gonna fade away, but you will remain, and he's again. He's never saying that to angels angels prophets.
Speaker 2:He didn't say that to moses yeah he didn't even let moses enter the promised land. What he did for the son, he has not done for anybody or anything else?
Speaker 1:continuing, he says to which of the angels has he ever said sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool at your feet. Are they not all ministering spirits sent out to serve for the sake of those who are to inherit salvation? Which, there again, he says that earlier. Like he makes his angels, winds and his ministers a flame of fire, a flame of fire, like he's using them. They have a role and that's not a bad thing. And these jewish people have said okay, they're a part of a culture, they're holy. We need to maybe even to the point of we need to worship them. And I feel like we're saying the same thing over and over again here. But that's what the writer's saying. He's just wanting to make sure that there's levels here and jesus is at the top, and obviously there had to have been a reason that the writer wrote this in that time culturally, or there would have been no reason for him to write this. So these jews were dealing with a kind of a hierarchy problem here yeah, I think.
Speaker 2:So. This is where it gets complicated, right? So this guy specifically wrote to um the jewish and he has a very, very good knowledge, knowledge of the jewish community and the old testament, right. So you can dive into this and you can go pretty deep into this chapter one. But when you break it down, who are you putting above? Jesus and? And I, and I think of today's modern society and I I think of idols with this. I think people put their, their preachers or their pasture above what they should like, and, and I feel like people and this isn't like a, it's not a knock on catholics, because I see it in the christian community too I gotta go to the leader in my church and have them pray for me yeah I gotta go to confession.
Speaker 2:I gotta go to nick. Now there is confess to one another. Yeah right, biblical, it's biblical, but like you don't have to go to that person to have a relationship with Jesus, now it's not exactly what this guy is pointing to. I feel like that's what he's saying here is, jesus is far greater than any of these angels or the prophets. He's far greater than Peter or Paul, isaac, moses, aaron, name them all. Right, he ruled over all of that and I think we get that confused and we want to go to our church leadership for everything.
Speaker 2:We want to like have this business structure to how we work through our salvation and our sanctification.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and then the next chapter. My title starts Warning Against neglecting salvation, and salvation is the ultimate goal for the non-believer, for the believer to present to a non-believer only through jesus do we have salvation.
Speaker 2:I I think one of the like this jewish, the hebrews. They could believe in the angels, they believed in the prophets, but they struggled to believe in jesus.
Speaker 2:Christ came as a son, fully human, fully god walked this earth and he didn't demolish the roman empire like they all speculated what's gonna happen didn't come riding in on the golden chariot, right, yeah, with a sword and just kind of like in some of the Old Testaments, wipe out this community, right, that's what they're expecting and came very differently. And this writer is telling them he is the son of God.
Speaker 1:He is who he says he is. It didn't come out how you thought it was going to, but that wasn't ever the plan Right, it was your plan.
Speaker 2:And oftentimes, I think in today's society, we still get that all wrong, and part of that being that we we see this hierarchy that well, we gotta go through the food chain yeah right. That didn't match up with what their belief was and how it was gonna happen.
Speaker 2:To today, I think we still struggle with that and the fact that we think we got a call upon the angels and we gotta yeah go have billy bob joe pray for us, because he has the gift of whatever and, like you, just need to cultivate that relationship with jesus yeah, and I think there again, we said this a few minutes ago there is a place for that.
Speaker 1:There is a lot of biblical things that say, go to your brother and confess, go to the elders of church and have them pray over you when you're sick, like there are biblical things and I think they were. Maybe, maybe there's a this, there's a group here that this writer's writing to and again, I think today even there's a group of us, and sometimes a lot myself, in there. My chapter two, the first heading there is warning against neglecting salvation. That is the most important thing.
Speaker 1:These jewish people have a history and a culture of following the rules and going by these rules and going by a hierarchy, and and I think the the goal and the point of christianity is it's about jesus, it's salvation through jesus alone. All this other stuff doesn't matter. It's good. It's good for you. You'll show fruit from it, but your don't forget about the point with salvation. Don't go back to. Well, I need to pray, pray to Mary, or I need to pray to an angel, because they're sitting at no. Jesus is sitting at the right hand of the Father and that's where we get our salvation from, and we'll go into more of that next week because chapter two talks a lot about our salvation. But I think there's a group here struggling with roles and with where their sights need to be set on.
Speaker 2:Once again, this is definitely a letter in my Bible. This is how it's described.
Speaker 1:It has a section here.
Speaker 2:Once again, this is the NIV Everyman's Bible. It says who wrote it. We don't know, probably not Paul. Style is quite different. The author was certainly highly educated, with a thorough knowledge of the jewish religious practices in the old testament yeah but that doesn't mean it doesn't apply to today. But you could take this chapter and you could break this thing down and we could probably make three to four episodes out of it because you could dive into.
Speaker 2:Well, how did god speak to our ancestors? Like we just briefly hit them right, we named like three or four. He spoke through burning bush to moses. He spoke through dreams, he spoke through angels. There's a whole various ways that he spoke to people and then you can break down each one of these. You are my son, I will be his father and he will be my son. Like you can go into those verses, like you can really take this thing and you can really break it down. But, as we spoke to, one of the key concepts is is over and over in here. It is that jesus christ is who he said he was and he did the things he said he came to do yeah, just it kind of feels like we said the same thing over and over again.
Speaker 1:He's because we said that too, but I'm just looking ahead like I. I said talk about salvation in chapter two, but then chapter three, heading Jesus is greater than Moses. Chapter five Jesus is greater than the high priest. Chapter seven Jesus compared to Melchizedek. Like the, the writer of Hebrews is making sure that this group knows Jesus is the one. Yeah, and we'll break it all down as we go through hebrews. It's going to take us a while. This is a little bit bigger book than the other ones we've done and there's so much in this um. So make sure you're subscribed, make sure you follow wherever you're listening to this, share it so we can get it out to as many people as we can share it with the person that you're going to follow along with us with so that you can have discussion after we're done. Thank you so much for being a part of the Two Fixed Community. Next week we'll be back. Hebrews, chapter 2.